Am I the only one who has stopped testing?

Just wondering if I'm the only one because the forum seems to have died compared to how it was a couple months ago.  I stopped when the errors I was submitting kept being ignored and now that I've found that there'll be yet another beta with no upgrade script I've decided that testing is a waste of time.  Not only are the problems that are found ignored, I'm wasting my time creating data to test that I'll only have to delete and recreate later.  It seems that staff wants to use our time for testing but doesn't really value it at all.  I wonder how many people would be more willing to play around with the script if the staff was more responsive, particularly to the repeated request for an upgrade script rather than fresh install after fresh install...  It seems to me that if you want people to help you then you should make it as easy as possible for them to do so.

ditto

UPDATE:  By the way, not only is having to tear down our work demoralizing, but the timing of these betas has made it even worse.  Just configuring one of these installs takes a ton of time - usually two or three weeks, and that has been the exact time frame for the beta releases.  This means that just when most of us have a semi-respectable site we can show people, it is time to destroy it and start all over again.

Would you like to know hot to add trac tickets?

Post here your bug and every day add a reply with UP text...better if 2 times per day....don't worry if it come to 500 replies....but continue...

I've requested to add a ticket for a bug before b7...3 reply posted...no ticket added and b7 come out with the bug... THIS IS BOONEX!

WASTE OUR TIME FOR TEST AND ADD TO TRAC WHAT THEY WANT!

I know, either that or make your post completely inflammatory - better yet, put it on your blog with an attack on Boonex.  That is the only thing they seem to respond to.

It is a really big mistake not to include an upgrade script for each beta, it really puts a downer on the people who are trying to help test the thing but having to start for scratch each time. I dont know anybody with that much time or patience to keep going beta after beta. Made worse i think when bugs reported are getting ignored, and showing up again in the next beta.

Its all getting a bit disheartening, which i think is being reflected in how the forum has gone quiet apart from the usual.

Not nice to say, but people are getting totally fed up now.

Regards

Tyke

I stopped by here today to just see where everything was at with this.  I see nothing has changed.  I gave up on this weeks ago and put the money out for a script that is flawless.  I did contribute financially to Boonex when all of this started because I believed in them then.

I am not saying abandon ship.  However, this whole process shows that those at Boonex are not as capable as I once thought.  Sad but true.

From beta to beta it maybe a lot of changes and it can take a lot of time to make  correct update for all data, it may take much more time and waiting for RC will be definitely longer.

The only reason to not provide upgrade script for beta is to save some time for development and bug fixing.

Also join and creating different data is the process which is need to be tested well too with each beta.

We try to read every post in forum and most of the bugs are not a bugs, it just a way user see it. "Only bugs are accepted" - it is rather relative thing, and of cause we (as developers) accept only functional bus as usual for now, because the time when features list were coded and design was made has already past.

Most of the things which are reported as bugs:

- lack of the feature is not a bug

- useless feature is not a bug

- design improvement is not a bug

- wrong setup is not a bug

- wrong hosting environment is not a bug

- using old version of browsers (IE6 as usual) is not a bug

- wrong crontab setup (or no setup at all) is not a bug

Most of such reports are ignored, because we have no time to answer every post (but we try to read it at least -  to make a decision)

I would have to agree somewhat with AlexT when he quotes "what is a bug and what is not". I have seen several people post "bugs" in the forum, however in the same thread see that it is working for other people. I would think that a "bug" would affect all people and not just a few. This would indicate a possible configuration/environment problem.

As for testing, I try to continue testing the areas of Dolphin that reflect what my site is for. Since I do not use it as a "dating" site, there are many things that I do not even attempt since I will not be using them anyway.

Me too.

I am new here and because of that, have little experience with Dolphin. I like what I see and like the previous poster, do not have plans to use it as a dating site. Because of this, there are many sections I don't even bother to test.

I try to offer what I can though and sometimes it's my own lack of knowledge of the software that causes me to make posts that don't have any real value..... but I do try and I am never offended when something doesn't get addressed.

In my opinion, everyone needs to quit whining and reset their goals to helping make the finished product as bug free and exciting as possible. I see a lot of progress here with the betas. I love the idea I can watch Trac and keep abreast of what's going on. It keeps me interested to see movement towards the finished product even if it is behind the lines.

Once Dolphin 7 goes RC, I will be purchasing a premium membership ..

Alex, thank you for telling us you won't provide an upgrade script so you can "save some time for development and bug fixing" - but what about our time?  We are wasting massive amounts of time partially building sites in Dolphin, only to have to tear them down again with each new beta.  If you can't provide a "supported" upgrade script, then how about an "unsupported" one - say "use at your own risk" or something like that.  If not that, then at least publish a list of tables that we can safely restore, and a procedure for doing it safely.    There is absolutely no reason to keep testing if we can't upgrade - or at least partially upgrade and save some of the work we have done in configuring this system.   Please ask Boonex to help any way they can with this.

Thank you

Rob

p.s.  SkyForum  - please don't accuse people of "whining" because you don't agree with them.  This is a serious concern for many of us.

Alex, how it is possible to test a site without users? We each time adjust new installation. We see only a surface. And what will be, when on a site 100 users will come?
I do not say that it is necessary to add new possibilities. All say about correction of that does not work.

Videos comments did not work still in D7B5. It and now does not work, but the ticket and is not added. It only one, is more many the similar.

Please, provide carrying over of profiles of users. At least only it. Then whining to stop. There will be a good testing and real errors.

run a live site using the beta version

once the final version (RC) is out you can always upgrade manually

users,profiles,setting,....files.......... i know it will be time consuming but its possible

that's what im doing :))

@ SkyForum - since you, by your own admission, are new and inexperienced, perhaps that also means you're not qualified to judge what is whining and what is legitimate frustration on behalf of the testers.  When you've spent months building and then tearing down sites with little support from staff perhaps you'll be more qualified to comment.

@ Alex - I understand that people like to cry "bug" when it's really just a new feature that they want but when multiple people report the same error and staff blow it off, that's a problem.  When multiple people report that something is NOT WORKING, and staff never responds, that's a problem.  Perhaps it is a configuration issue, but if staff never responds when problems are reported, how exactly are we supposed to know it's a configuration problem and not just staff ignoring us?  I know that personally my long-distance mind reading skills are a bit rusty...

The good example is video comments, it requires Media Server for its functioning, it is reported very often that video comments are not working. BoonEx staff don't answer to such posts, but many thanks to the community which helps in such situations, by remind about Media Server.

Other examples are similar, most probably the problem is known and discussed many times before, and Boonex do not answer to such problems. Because it is the very first thing every user need to know on every forum - post your question only if you can not find answer by yourself from existing posts, blogs, manual, etc.

RMS installed. Video is recorded and reproduced (normal). Video comments - error. Log comes to e-mail.

I'll wait the rest of testers, apparently my hands curves.

But do not talk about it. Read the last post here on CALTRADE, I completely agree with him.

http://www.boonex.com/unity/blog/entry/Dolphin_7_Hookie_BETA_7_with_online_demo_2009_10_09

I've lost all interest in testing.  When some requests for rudimentary missing features, like word filters to control profanity, very basic moderation tools, the ability to disallow certain words, or strings in user names when registering, etc. .... it gets a little discouraging.  Some 'Features' that I would call basic to any type of community, have been put off until 7.1 ..... maybe then they'll get put off until 7.2 ... who knows...

With that said, I'd rather Boonex spend their time refining the code rather than pasifying people with beta to beta upgrade scripts.  I had no problems with fresh installs, up until the point the rush to get a product released, displaced logical thinking.  What good is a bug free feature that has serious flaws in usability?

I think I'll just go play golf every day for the next 3 months, and see where this thing is in January.

Houston is pointing his finger in the right direction !!!

I was trying many times to say the same thing using the word ergonomics (human - computer interaction).

The logic of a "standard" site user is not exactly the same like the logic of a programmer.

To use Dolphin is sometimes a real nightmare. A labyrinth (maze) with uncertain exit, esoteric road-signs (buttons/links labels) and dead end pages...

Without reliable Blocked members and Bad words filter features, running a Dolphin site with more than a few hundreds members could be a nightmare for the site admin too.

There are basic functions of the code that are still not not working after several beta releases. As others have said here, I believe that too much time is being spent on non-essential elements and not enough attention is being paid to the reports of  critical flaws that prevent the script from being used at all in a live environment.  Some of these critical functions are known issues that have been around for multiple beta versions.

I am at the point now where I feel there has been too much time spent with too little progress after so many betas.  Like others who have made comments to this blog, I too am at the point of wanting to stop testing the script for lack of results on what now appears to be an endless cycle of non-updatable betas which fix a lot of little things and still does not produce a fully functioning (at the basic level) system.

I am now ready to join the ranks of other webmasters who have decided to stop testing and wait for a more 'testable' version to appear.  Sorry (Boonex) guys, I like Dolphin, and I do appreciate the effort that your team makes to bring us a top-notch high-end (and still available for free) product, but for now, the beta process has outlasted my patience and my ability to sustain enough interest to continue testing. I'll check back from time to time to see how things are going.  Best of luck, Boonex team. I love the concept and in general, I appreciate the tough job you guys have.

 From Vagabondette

Excuse me? I am the last person you want to try to bash here. I have been an internet community afficionado since before the internet existed. I am an old war horse that used to pay $1000 phone bills to BBS into sites all over the world just to play Trade Wars 2002! What I said was I have limited experience with Dolphin. That does NOT mean I have limited experience building a community! Since Aug of 2005 I have been building a site based on another portal software called Soop. The support for that community after 3 years has completely vanished leaving me with a completely unsupported software package that is anything but complete. Have you ever tried to get someone to answer a question from a "community project" where going to the site once a week makes you the prolific poster of the community?

I see movement here EVERYDAY. To me that is fabulous! People have lives, even the creators of this package and they cannot sit in front of their computer screens 24/7 just to make you happy. You need to be patient, spend a little time reuploading you data with each new beta (BTW, I don't find that irritating in the least) and quit bitching about something you really know very little about and by that I mean, what it actually takes to create a community package at this level of complexity. Why don't you take a night off and go on a date or something?

In my opinion, if you cannot support the issue at hand, make sure you don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.

BTW, my community, towtalk.net is now the number #2 towing & recovery forum in the world. Lets see you take something as illiterate as tow truck drivers and get them onto the computer every single day. With more than 1700 companies FROM AROUND THE WORLD represented on towtalk, my abilities at this will never be in question by anybody as they shouldn't be by you.

Now, I will say it again. QUIT WHINING!

@Tech66 - re: "how it is possible to test a site without users?"  - great point - it isn't, and since only a few people have built sites with users, the testing has become lousy. 

@Skyforum- re: "don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out" - your posts are rude and provide no value.  Every single person who has posted on this thread - regardless of their opinions, has contributed far more here than you have.

@Gary11 - "There are basic functions of the code that are still not not working... As others have said here, I believe that too much time is being spent on non-essential elements".  Right on brother!  Basic functions - like the join form!  What can be more basic then that?

@prolaznik - Good for you! (not sarcastic).  Most people here don't have the skills to mess with diff files, etc.  I thought I could import my profile fields table last time, but totally trashed my install.  This time, I am building D7B7 almost totally by hand- which I know could be a huge waste of time.   Any information you, and others here who have done the beta upgrades, can share would be appreciated.

@Alex - we are really happy you are here as a representative of Boonex.  Can you see that we are involved in a vicious cycle here though?  Fewer and fewer people are testing this as there is no advantage to them, so critical bugs and flaws are going unidentifed - which means they will just carry over to the next beta.  ANY help you - and Boonex, can give helping us save as much of our work as possible to the next beta or rc will help break this cycle.

Hi there,

I am new to this community but am willing to try to help out any way I can because I like the looks of what I see so far.  I can code fairly well, I think, and usually try to post things I have discovered along the way in forums or on my websites as will I do with this community.  I understand the work involved in developing something like this.  So developers, don't get discouraged by people who simply don't understand.  You know what youre doing so keep doing it, youre doing a great job from what I can see.

I have a suggestion about a way to solve this testing problem.  Why don't you set up a dedicated testing site/server?  That way people don't have to spend the time installing and configuring the software and can spend more time using it.  Perhaps you could also make it possible to install an individual install automatically, such as the way Fantastico installs things or Virtualmin script installers.  Or you could have them spawn their own separate demo site with its own address that they have full control over.  Then if they like they could potentially just export the database and import it into their own site if they so desire.

I don't know if that is possible with Dolphin but it seems to me like something that would probably not be too hard to set up so its all automated.  That would solve the wasting of time problem and you could also get a sense of how people use the software to test and see what they're testing and what they aren't testing etc. and you can make requests on what to test.

BTW, is it even possible to have multiple installs on one server?  Or would the video java server thing have to run multiple instances and eat up all the memory?

Ryan

The test site already exist:

http://demozzz.com/dolphin7b/

But I and (I think) other people want to have admin access and check all admin features and if there are bugs add it to forum, this speed up developing....to have the admin access there are only a way...build your own site!

SkyForum, I don't care if you're God and helped Al Gore invent the internet.  Your experience with other platforms has no bearing on this question.  This question was directed to those who have spent months banging their heads agains the wall doing testing that isn't having a result and are burnt out.  Since you're new and inexperienced here (your words, not mine), the question really doesn't apply to you.

I'm looking roadmap and I have understand...

Don't worry! To have a real community you have to wait....

ALL YOU NEED FOR A REAL COMMUNITY are going to 7.1!

I think Boonex aren't offering assistance...

Everyone write in forum problems that real have...I (and other people) don't like to spend time to write for a non existant bug or problem...

BUT WHEN SOMEONE OF BOONEX TEAM SEE A POST AND UNDERSTAND IT'S A USER/SERVER PROBLEM, NOT A BUG/Dolphin PROBLEM WRITE IT!! I'M NOT ASKING EXPLANATION ONLY A SIMPLE: Not a bug!

Without writing it seems Boonex don't take care of testers and we can take our head and bang it against the wall because we think it's a bug and you it's not a bug BUT NO ONE HAVE THE SOLUTION...how many time take to write 3 words?

So do you think we scared Alex off?

@Mankya... I have to admit that 6.1.4 is my version of choice, that always seemed to work well, until it got patched to 6.1.6 then it all fell to bits again. Not to mention the 6 is a lot more friendly to install and for the users to use too. D7 is just not user friendly at all.

That the point to asking for a beta upgrade path though, it takes forever to to get it installed, and the thought that all that work wont last more than a few weeks is very off putting.

Ive no idea why Dolphin is so hard and picky to install and to run, it cant be the complexity of it, i mean just look at something like social engine, and thats easy to install and will host practically anywhere, must have something to do with how dplphin is coded or something.

It is frustrating and thats for sure.

Regards

Tyke